5.0 Five-Fold & Beyond - Dr. Matt and Amy Carpenter
5.0 Five-Fold & Beyond - Dr. Matt and Amy Carpenter
When teams face crisis
Staring down the barrel of a leadership crisis can either set you ablaze or forge you into something greater – which will it be for you? Our latest episode doesn't just explore this question; it offers the strategies and insight to ensure you emerge victorious. We bring to light the various crises that can rattle an organization, from the financial quicksands to the moral mazes, and how a leadership team's composition is pivotal in these high-stakes moments. Drawing inspiration from 2 Corinthians 4:8-9, we discuss transforming potential breaking points into opportunities for unity and progress, because let's face it, adversity isn't going anywhere – but neither are we.
As the host, I delve into a conversation that runs deeper than crisis management; it's about the essence of a team's spirit in the face of fire. With the same solidarity that fortifies couples in pre-marriage counseling, we dissect the principles of support and shared responsibility essential for leadership teams. Here, personal growth and the finesse of handling home crises become powerful lessons for steering your team through stormy seas. This episode provides a blueprint for crafting an environment where security and cooperation are the bedrock, ensuring that when the heat rises, your team doesn't just survive but thrives.
In our final discourse, we balance the scales of leadership, measuring vulnerability against conviction. We lay out the collaborative leadership framework, illustrating how each member contributes to fleshing out the bare bones of a collective vision. We also stress the value of external strategic advisors who, like reinforcements in battle, provide the support needed to navigate tumultuous times. For anyone leading through crises or looking to bulletproof their team, this episode is a beacon, guiding you towards a strategy that aligns divine wisdom with the strength of a united front.
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Welcome to 5.0, 5 Foldin' Beyond. With Matt and Amy. In the 5.0 podcast, we're going to peel back the layers of the Ephesians 4 model revealing a thriving church ministry or organization. This will help leaders to identify, work together, implement or raise up the believers who want to move in their calling.
a:We also offer seminars, conferences and strategic advising to pastors and leaders. We'll sit down with you and help you to learn how to have a 5 Fold influenced church or organization. I'm also going to show you how to identify and integrate people with 5 Fold giftings into your teams and organization. So connect with us at ihemtvcom.
m:So get ready to engage, as these podcasts will open an understanding, remove confusion of the 5 Fold and open your eyes and heart to what you and those around you carry. Welcome to this podcast with Matt and Amy, and we're going to be talking about some interesting things again today in 5.0, when we want to speak specifically to leaders and their teams. So what happens when team faces crises? That's what we're going to call this episode. Thank you for joining us. Please share this or subscribe on your media platforms. So thanks, I'm excited.
a:This is a great topic we have today, yeah, and it's so relevant because you can't have a team that never faces crisis. Things are going to happen.
m:Right, because crises will make it or break it. So we got some things we want to talk about impact of crises on teams, how we respond. What's the job or responsibility of the 5.0 leader or the set leader? What is the things going on with different team members inside? How do they contribute All that kind of stuff? How do we deal with problems, face of problems or crises? We're going to use that terminology today. I think this is very practical and is a great how to in this session, right.
a:Yes.
m:So crises, whether it's financial, moral failures. Let's list a few. Three crises ministry and personnel problems, replacements, building projects, loss of a mission in the organization Right Problem people. I want some more.
a:Sinful leadership, Maybe just lack of integrity? Persecution, egos can be something that really gets in the way and launches crises or rebellion that stems from that Making quick expansion. There's a pleasant problem to have, but can take you quickly into a crisis if you're not prepared Right. A new template is required. Maybe you've got new team members.
m:On foreseen changes. Right, dealing with betrayal, spiritual suns walking away, witchcraft at work, old methodologies or just stuck. I mean we can go on and on and on.
a:Oh yeah.
m:But we listed some because you, as a listener, need to be able to relate to what we're talking about, and so stay with us in this episode, because this we're going to address some things head on, as we always do, and we're going to give some solutions and some perspectives, maybe that you haven't thought about, or maybe you did, and this is just a confirmation. So what's the word of God have for this situation that we're going to talk about?
a:I want to read a familiar passage. I think it Corinthians four versus eight and nine. It says we are pressed on every side by troubles, but we are not crushed. We are perplexed but not driven to despair. We are hunted down but never abandoned by God. We get knocked down but we are not destroyed because, ultimately, when crisis impacts that changing is an LT.
a:When crisis impacts your team, one of two things is going to happen. It's going to either separate your team or save your team. It will either divide your team or drive your team. Drive them forward, put them into action.
m:Right, as good of planners as you might be, you can do the best that you can to prepare for crises, but crises comes in so many forms. Sometimes it's unexpected. Yeah Right, usually it's unexpected. It does not negate the thing that you should not prepare. Prepare the best you can and the things that you see that is lacking or that needs work on. Continue to do that, put your hand to it and be diligent. But crises will come and you thought you planned for every contingency and all of a sudden it's different. People responded differently than you thought they would. Maybe you responded differently than when you thought One thing to remember about teams, because we want to talk about teams a lot today and leading teams in both areas or arenas, wherever you find yourself in Jobs are more than someone that you delegate to do all the jobs you don't like to do. In this context of what we're talking about in a cutting edge team environment, we have to look at this more than a boss-employee relationship. This is what every joint supplies. Everyone has something to contribute.
a:Co -laborers.
m:Yeah, it's an awesome football team or hockey team, whatever it's more in that perspective of that, the idea of having a team is to have the right people in the right places so that the vision can move forward, but also so that you can access them, that they have pieces that you don't, or different perspectives than what you have as a set leader. They all have something awesome and valuable to be able to contribute, to be able to access that, I think, is the most important thing, you'll find out what your team's made of and if you've got the right people when crisis hits.
a:Correct. Yeah, they are just there to fill in the jobs, to be your grunt labor. When the crisis hits, they're not going to stick around. They don't have anything invested, correct?
m:Yeah.
a:It's having the right people that have something invested in the mission, the vision, the assignment that that team is focusing on. That's huge. Yeah, you do find that out. Crisis will. It has a way of weeding out those who are not connected well or who are not invested Sometimes. That's okay. That's really a good thing. Yeah, but we're talking about presuming that you've got the right people on the team. How do we launch or get this team through that crisis?
m:Right. Here's what crisis does it creates a pressure. That pressure is applied, and it requires the team to apply new ideas, new actions and responsibilities to overcome that pressure. So Responding to the pressure is one thing and we're going to talk about that a little bit later this to maintain or get our footing, but that's another to overcome that pressure, because the idea of the crises is to stir things up that are hidden, that can come to the surface, and suddenly you've discovered new things that you can apply. So we're going to talk about that in this session as well. So there's a requirement that's needed for this, then, right. So once a team gets its footing After that initial onslaught of that crisis, whatever that may look like, well, something has to happen, right?
a:Yes, they have to rise to the occasion to surpass the limits of that crisis. But how do you get your team to do that? Even presuming you have all the right team members really like good teams can fall apart when crisis hits. So what do we as leaders, as five-fold ministers?
m:need to do Five point overs. I call you.
a:Right To be able to help pull that team together and cause the right things to happen.
m:Yeah.
a:Right, not that we can make it all happen, because when crisis comes, typically we have very little control, but there are things we can do, and so that's what we want to look at, the first one being communication.
m:Before you get there, let's do your commercial.
a:A little commercial.
a:I wrote a book a year ago called Propelled by Crisis, and this book. It's not geared toward teams specifically, but it has great principles in it that you can use for teams, and the whole premise of this book is that crisis is going to hit, but when it hits, we don't want it to knock us back. We don't want it to crush us, like the verse I read in the beginning. Instead, crisis can actually be used as a tool, when handled right yeah, yep To propel you forward into what God has for you, to actually accelerate your life, your goals, your vision, instead of knocking you back 10 steps or whatever.
m:So where do they get this at?
a:This can be purchased on our website, ihemtvcom, so go ahead Also on Amazon. Yes, on Amazon as well. Go ahead and get yourself a copy Propelled by Crisis by Dr Amy Carpenter. You just type that, punch that in and you'll find it. It is really a great tool. If you know someone who's going through crisis too, or teams, this can get them in the right frame of mind.
m:Right Helps clear things identify what you're dealing with. It takes the mystery out of some things to be able to look, because we're in a pain reaction right now and so we're trying to respond in one way. We either shut down or confusions overwhelming us all that and it helps us to be able to reestablish our footing, to be able to deal and to cope not just cope with it, but to deal with what is the crisis is all about. And you can apply this to teams and leadership, self-improvement, leadership skill building, whatever, because what?
a:we have to realize is that the very same fire that burns up a house purifies precious metals and gems, and so it's not the fire, is not what makes the difference. The crisis is not what makes the difference as to whether something is destroyed or purified and brought to its most brilliance. Right, it's what that's made of, and so it's recognizing. You know, this crisis is going to help show what our team is made of, what I'm made of, and so that's why it's so important and we want to give you these keys today, or even more in the book, but today for your teams, so that when that crisis comes, that the precious things come out. Yeah.
m:And a thing for you 5.0 leaders right as we're going to break down some things that help us to be able to some tools here to unlock is in our personal life, take personal responsibility. So, when a crisis comes in our personal life and in our marriage, if there's a crisis and the first reactions and most common that you this is the way you always react, and this is how you react is yelling and fighting and we're at odds with one another, then your leadership that'll be the same way, in the way you lead and hit crisis with your team. It will be one of micro control, one of aggressive things, because things are spiling, emotions are high, anger can come, humanity can come into your teams and there's this same same elements or, yeah, that's what I'm looking for Elements that begin to manifest. So, if that's how you are personally, before you can even bring anything of what we're talking about into your teams, you got to fix things at home, get things right with how you respond to crises.
m:So, like when we do pre marriage counseling, we often will do some, some exercises, and one of those things is I get them to stand up back to back and they're able to see all around them, and I say this is what happens when problems and pressures and crises comes into your team, which is marriage that you're going to when you get married and you need to have each other's back, not stabbing each other in the back. Not one way is better than the other way you work together and that whole concept is what is applied in your leadership. If you are in that position or responsibility of leading others, then you, once that's fixed with you personally, it will go over into helping other people in their team members and it eliminates that aggressiveness and fighting and arguing and people being insecure and jealous and whatever All those things. It shuts that out because that's not the environment that you're creating. So, as you mentioned, one of the first things is actually before we go there you know, because you're in a great role, that's gay communications.
m:I'm going to wait my Kaiser role.
a:No, I picked up on something that you said and there's a good concept here that we didn't even put in our notes. No, as we're just came to me, you know, but no, and this is so important because, see, when crisis comes, like you say, our response tends to be defensiveness, and sometimes even if this is your response, but you know, blaming let's try to figure out.
m:Oh, that's a good one. Blaming others, yeah, for a fault.
a:Oh, this is the fault of the government or this is the fault of you. Know, nature or God did this, or it's your fault because you didn't do this right. And as soon as we start that blame game, nothing can be fixed. You're going to turn on each other and things are going to fall apart. There's the destruction of your team. So we have to set aside the blame game. I know that when crisis comes, sometimes it's nobody's fault. Sometimes it's just one of those things, or at least nobody within you or your team. Other times it is. But regardless of whose fault it is, just playing the blame game will cause you to, to fight, to compete, to.
a:That's right so the response instead has to be to take personal responsibility. Yeah now I'm not saying you say oh, it's my fault, when it isn't your fault. That's not what I mean by personal responsibility. Let's let's lay aside trying to figure out who's fault it is. Yeah and let's look at okay, what do I need to do now? What responsibility can I take personally Towards fixing this thing? Because, as long as I'm looking at, it's your fault, is your fault, it's their fault.
m:I'm not putting myself in a place to take any responsibility to enact any energy isn't going into fine solution finding it's, it's just into trying to get rid of these feelings that I have, you know yeah that's. That's where we get in a vortex going around and around, and that's why you feel like a chicken running with its head cut off in a crisis and you're overstressed, you're freaking out and I'm not saying that there's not stress and things coming, but they don't have those moments right, but we have, we understand that there's something beyond that, and especially if you're feeling that as a five point, oh, leader, what about your teams that are hooked and connected to you?
m:So you, you know, for the sake of the team, you got to begin to fix real fists fast. One of those ways is now exactly, and that's why communication.
a:So, important because see crisis will bring confusion along with it does when, when things are happening. It's cloudy there. There is. It's part of that thing is the emotions that you're talking about. That come up can often Cloud our judgment. The confusion comes in disappointment.
m:You know that sick feeling in your stomach, boy, I wasn't expecting that, a bitter taste, you know. You know it's really and everything happened. I don't know which way's up. Yeah, yeah, trying to figure out bad things, what is?
a:even happening here. How did that happen? Why did that happen? I never expected that to happen. So all of that you're dealing with you're playing with, and so that's why talking with one another is so important.
a:And I know that the temptation is sometimes, when you're a leader and you're reeling with this crisis and whatever's happened, the temptation can be to isolate yourself and put yourself in and just try to get yourself through it. But, more importantly, you've got a team here that you have to hold together. I mean, I think about Jesus and everything he was going through, and I understand because of his divine nature and his heart that was so yielded to God. But also he was human and he knew what was coming. He knew the crisis that was impending, but he knew he had a group of disciples that really needed his voice. And you know, when you start to read the, the Chapters that lead up to the crucifixion and the events that occurred there, you, you see him and it seems like.
a:I know that he's talking to riddles sometimes, but what he was doing was he was sharing his heart and he was preparing them for the crisis and even when it happened, just because they initially to what happened when, when Jesus was arrested, they dispelled. I mean, they're like whoa, we don't, you know. After the garden, they just all kind of who scattered, but because of his word, because of the relationship that he built with him, they, they started to gather again. And even when he told them, you know, wait in the upper room Before he was ascended into heaven, like so many things, just just read through that and you'll see how he handled his team and prepared them and Comforted them and strengthened them after crisis. And there's an example of an amazing leader right there.
m:Yeah, like you know, recently, when things are important to you and you have feel the responsibility because you initiated something with your team and you're moving in that, and then you come across a crisis comes. Sometimes it can take the wind right out of your sail. It's like a punch in the gut and sometimes it stuns you. And you know, just recently we went through that and it paralyzed me for like nine months with this particular thing. I didn't know which way to go. And you know, reach out to those that had similar experiences and you're trying to, you know, make that work for you, just kind of personalizing it, and it's like it's it's similar but different, and and so you take that Peace, but yet you're still, you know. So I know what it's like for you to, because you feel the responsibility, but it doesn't mean that you have to come up with the answer all by yourself.
m:Remember, that's the reason why you have a team around you and you should have the right team, and I'm talking about the team that is day to day. We also have another team. You know we're not talking about teams, but you should have another team of fellow peers that speak into you and those times where you can speak into them as well, but you can draw on them on those times. So you have two different levels. So we're talking about the team that works with you on day to day. Yeah, and that's why you need to open up that communication, because once you do that right, you got a well of gifts and talents and ideas that they were keeping in, that they didn't even discover. Maybe, or maybe they had the inkling of an idea, of a solution, but because of lack of experience, they didn't know where to go with it. But that was the piece that you needed, right?
a:Right and you know, maybe maybe You're tempted to not reach out and not communicate as much with your team because you're like I don't even know what to tell them. I don't even know what to say to them at this point because I have no clue where to go. And you know what? It's okay.
a:Another, another key of Getting your, your team, through this crisis is that it's okay to be vulnerable. Vulnerability is okay in a leader, but sometimes we get this idea that we have to be these like superhero leaders who have it all figured out, who have all the answers, so that when our team members come to us, we can give them this great piece of wisdom. And you know everything and we that.
m:That's not always the case now we're not talking about vulnerability before the congregation, if you have a church, because what that vulnerability will do will cause a lot of them to stumble well, to a point.
a:To a point, right, I'm not saying you put out every thought you don't stand up there and say I have no clue what I'm doing totally.
m:They're the trust that you built up over the years or whatever. It's totally thrown at the window. So I'm not saying fake it either, but there's a fine line of that. But with your team they should be able to see your humanity At work and not just you're anointing and they love you for your humanity, they'd love you for that, they're there for that, and so when when that happens there's because that trust has been built and whatever, then then that Pressure of having to perform it's it's eased a bit and you can lay that down a little bit and have working room, creative room now and space to move within the realm of your team. So that's what vulnerability does, especially when you are the set leader, right, so you don't have to come up with a full picture.
a:Because if you're always coming up with a full picture, then that becomes the expectation and the precedent for that team Right. That I'm not all the answers. You guys are just once again You've got now minions who just fulfill everything that I tell you to do. And remember we talked about the beginning. That's not why we have teams right.
m:Part of the team health and especially shows up in times of crises, is when there's a sense of them being needed and they can take ownership in the solution that's going on. So vulnerability In that way creates vulnerability in them. Wow, if he or she is a opening up like that, I can open up then with some of my Worries, or some of my. Maybe my idea isn't stupid after all, and there's a sense of safety that is Developed within your team. Okay, so then they feel that what they have has value Right in merit.
a:Now, I always tell and that they're needed.
m:Right. I always tell my team guys I put out a skeleton, put the flesh on it and don't get mad if your idea is not used, because your idea will probably be a hybrid. It'll be morphed into the rest of the team members and before you know it, we've created this man. That's just language for the thing which needs to stand. All of a sudden there was nothing there and it became alive. And then the Holy Spirit breathes life into it, like the valley of bones. He breathes life into it and it begins to rise up and move into the will of God and what it's called to do.
a:Let me Vulnerability. Yes, I want to clarify, though, between vulnerability and lack of faith, because this is really important.
a:Another key is as the leader of this team, it's important to display confidence and faith in God that God will work it out. So when we say be vulnerable before your teams, I'm not saying go into that team meeting and say, oh whoa, it's us. I don't know what we're going to do. This is horrible, we're sinking, we're doomed. We might as well just close the doors and walk out. Not that doom and gloom. There's no hope. That's not vulnerability, that's lack of faith. Correct Vulnerability is. I don't have all the answers, but I know one who does, and together we're going to seek him and we're going to all add our pieces to the table and we're going to weather this storm.
m:And we're going to come out of it strong.
a:That's the difference. That's a leader who has confidence and faith in God and trusts that God has the pieces to the solution and he's going to reveal it to this team See the 5.0 leaders and this is another podcast, maybe, but the way we develop our teams is we got to stop looking at them as servants and start accepting them as sons.
m:And what happens when that is there? We break down the boss employee mentality and we start creating a sense of family and there's a new vibrancy within that team. So, when crises comes, you're not throwing each other overboard. You're looking at ways to save the ship or to build a new one or whatever it is in the middle of that crisis. So it's a whole different. You're creating a confidence within them that they can release and they can have faith to believe with you to accomplish whatever the solution is that we're going to come to. We're going to come to a solution, guys. God's good he's speaking to us, but we need to bring our pieces together.
a:Exactly so you, leader, need to, before you do the communicating piece.
a:if it takes you getting on your knees praying fast, whatever you need to do to get your heart in a place where you feel like you, not that you have all the answers, but where you feel like you can go before that team and say we've got this, with the help of our God, we will overcome. That's where you have to get to before that communication takes place. I love this quote from John Hagee. It says the leader demonstrates confidence that the challenge can be met, the need resolved, the crisis overcome. And that's what you have to do when you're coming into those meetings or those communication times is to demonstrate that kind of confidence in God.
m:So he'd mentioned talking about and here's the other key about prayer and getting the mind of God, the mind of Christ, spending and taking that time because it's vital and let's create this picture. So I have say I'm the set leader, that means the key leader, and I was seeking God and he started revealing something to me.
m:And I believe that's the heart of God, the mind of Christ. But it's only a piece, that's okay. We know one thing that it is the central, it is the core piece that we need, and we just have to build to it and add to it and strengthen it, feed it, nurture it, whatever. So I hold on to that thing. And maybe a word we call it in Christian circles. It's a word from God, it's a word. I got this word, but we don't know what it means yet. But we know it's a word, right.
m:So seeking the mind of God creates this. I picture it like this like a core, okay, center piece, and then everything else will be wound about it. Okay. So it's like the main root of a tree, and out of that main thing the tree will sprout and grow. But other roots will grow to help feed what is produced out of that core. Everything needs to come around this. It's the center point. Without this, there is no power, there's no life, it's dead. It's man's way, that's it. So when you get the God's way in that, then the team can start contributing, because if you put the responsibility on them too, to hear the mind of Christ and to pray about the situation, they're taking personal responsibility as well.
a:That's right. The onus falls on the team to find out.
m:So what's happening is they're starting to add their peace. Next thing, you know you've got a strong, a strong, strong peace. Right, we're going to talk about that coming up, we're going to build on that. So then what happens is that's what we're going to build on and God will clarify it. Holy Spirit will speak to us. He'll start clarifying what that is, because as each piece touches to it or layer if you want to talk about each layer is wound around this core piece, it starts coming to life.
m:You go oh, you know what, guys, this is starting to turn into something like something's happened. We're onto something here, and I believe that's the way the kingdom is, because God gives everything in seed form. We have the responsibility to plant that seed. That's why he's called the Lord of the Harvest, because it's up to him to bring about the harvest of that seed. So the seed dies, goes into the ground, boom, it produces a plant and the fruit looks totally different than the seed. But the seed was the concept or the beginning of what God was giving. And that's what the team needs that centerpiece, that concept, that seed, because out of that's going to come the solution, the overcoming of whatever is that hurdle that you're facing, even at that point, as you're starting, you don't have to say, okay, well, how does this seed, how does this fit, or how on earth is that going to happen?
a:No, just start with that and see what God reveals. And I tell you, we've even recently experienced a situation where we've had to do that and to see our team just step up and come out with just amazing things when we all put our peace in there, and it just led us to a strategic plan that is now getting us. We feel like we're making ground, coming up out of that crisis and, whoa, when you stick it in, some traction you get encouraged.
m:So let's talk about a concept rallying.
a:I love that. Okay, you've all seen those movies. Come on especially well if you're American. We tend to put that in a lot of our movies. There's the big battles and there's the warring.
m:What about war? So you know the crisis. You need to raise the whole army.
a:The Scottish too, I guess they all have to come together. I think you need to kind of say you're thinking like I don't know. Yeah medieval stuff Kills running around.
m:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
a:You know, there's always like the moment where it looks like all is lost. The crisis has come crushing down and somebody the leader someone rises up and gives a speech. If it is a US done movie, there's always an American flag waving in the background or something.
a:You know, and they're giving this speech and I'm thinking you guys need to move here. You know you're taking a really long time to talk when you got to handle the enemy or whoever's coming in, but what they're doing, this is such an important concept. That speech is an example of rallying the troops and you have to, as a leader, know how to rally your team.
m:Because, rallying out of rallying, what happens? There's a team intimacy that begins to grow, and this is unity. That's what comes, it translates into unity. So the resulting factor of this phenomenon is being on the same page. That is the vital, most important thing that we're talking, as we're talking through our points here, and the rallying is getting everybody onto the same page.
a:Part of rallying I think is really important when I think of and I know we're not like taking our doctrine from Hollywood here it's our example. Yeah, when you think about this, you know, you think about the rallying speech always harks people back to the mission.
m:The core vision. What, yeah, the why why?
a:we hear again. It taps into and flames the passion for what we're doing and why we're here. And so part of the rallying is just sometimes taking your team back to why did God put us here? Why did he call us here? Why did he give us this mission, this assignment, why is this vision so important? Where's that passion?
a:Let's tap into that passion that we had when God first called us and when we start looking into that and rallying with the word and okay, here's the biblical example of this. Let's go beyond Hollywood. The biblical example.
m:There you go. That's why we call this five-fold.
a:Paul tells Timothy war with the words of prophecy that I gave you.
a:Use those prophetic words? Why? Because those prophetic words stir us up. They say this was God's heart, this is God's intent for me, this is what God wants, and when I begin to remind myself of what God said and what he wants, then it stirs up that excitement, that passion. I'm like now this crisis is no match for God and what he has said, because God is faithful, god keeps his promises and you start to tap into that. It builds that confidence in your team and you're like, yeah, he overcame, we can overcome.
m:So, when this rallying what happens? It results in combining everyone's feelings, their emotions, their questions, their thoughts, their ideas and put it into a common flow, because everything's scattered at that moment. Right, it's like the crisis came Everybody's off in their own idea, trying to process, trying to work things out, and then you start moving into the solution phase, trying to see what pieces are available, what resources, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. What's happening is, in the rallying, all this comes together. So now we're at least one stream instead of 14 streams or whatever writing, all right. And then we're back to the concept, the core concept, the core central idea, and there's a weaving that's taking place.
m:And in all of this, the team's creativity starts happening and you're tapping into that. So now a new paradigm is opening up, because the team came to another level. We're not just maintaining and getting our footing, we're actually looking at a way to overcome this problem, we're looking at a solution to this crisis. And so this whole new paradigm, everything now stems out of this. It's the new root system, it's the new river, it's the new place of a well, a new well.
a:And it's so much stronger at this point Like think about it in Ecclesiastes 412. It says, though one may be overpowered, two can defend themselves. A cord of three strands is not quickly broken.
m:There you go. There's that weaving.
a:And how easy is it, in a crisis, when you're standing alone, to be overwhelmed, to feel like you're being overpowered, outmatched? But when you come together, when your team starts to come together and you rally them, then you don't feel so overwhelmed, you feel like, man, we can do this, and I mean again. That's something we've recently experienced, when the team just started to talk about with ideas and contribute and come together.
a:It's like we didn't feel overwhelmed anymore. We didn't feel like we were carrying it alone. And that's what needs to happen to get through this crisis and to get through it Not just. You know, when I say get through it, I don't mean just, oh, by the skin of our teeth. We barely made it through alive. I'm talking about no, we came through with power.
m:Let's talk about one more thing, just to close this up. Sometimes you have to recognize when you need an outside perspective.
a:Yeah, you know, when you're in the middle of something, what's that old saying that says you can't see the forest through the trees? And it's true. It's so hard to be objective and to see some things when you're right in the middle of it.
a:In the middle of it. You know, when you're in the middle of a hurricane, which we have been, when you're in the middle of a hurricane, you can't see more than you know. 10 feet in front of you, through the wind and the rain and the fog and the clouds, you can't see the bigger picture a lot of times, and so to hear from a voice that is mature and wise, that's not standing in the middle of all that, this outside of that, can be very beneficial.
m:It's not a sign of weakness. It's not a sign that you got bad leadership. It's actually means that you have wisdom to tap into what's everything that is available. And once you know that something is available, why wouldn't you want to lessen or shorten your crises? Because that's what happens.
a:Definitely.
m:Oh, yeah, when you start finding out all these pieces or the missing pieces and you put the picture together, it's like, ah, that's it right there, you still have the responsibility to carry it out and, especially if you can access apostolic strategic advising and that's what we do. Yeah, that's what we do and we have done and we're doing for people, whether they're emerging in a new phase of their ministry or whether it's a whole church going through a crisis or a time or transition, or a new paradigm or new wineskin. This is what we do and and so, yeah, we have to make this available, because a lot of people don't know that we do this. There's a lot of people going. What do you mean?
a:There's a lot of leaders or who can help us.
m:Yeah, there's a lot of leaders that don't know that they do that, that they feel that they have to, and meanwhile they're being crushed and getting a bad taste in their mouth for leadership and for ministry and whatever it is, and they want to get out and it's because they feel like they're alone and that they didn't understand that there is this thing. That's out there, right.
a:Let me give you this picture Just to end with here. It's heavy. I don't know if you've ever gone through one of those mazes. We've gone through some different mazes and you know Corn mazes and you're trying.
a:You know, running around, trying to get yourself out of there, you're bumping into walls, you're hitting dead ends and it can be very frustrating at times.
a:But you know, I don't know if you've seen some of those sometimes they have a maze, but then they have like a stool or like a tower stool, almost like a lifeguard Tower.
a:You know that someone can go up on a ladder and sit up and they can see over the whole maze and they can actually if you get lost, so they can give you directions to go right or left and to get through that maze. And it's kind of like that when you get strategic advice and when you talk with a mentor or a leader that can speak into you is that you know you're, you're running around, you're hitting dead ends, but man, if you had someone who could just tell you that way's a dead end, go left or go right, how much quicker you can get through that maze. And you can do it unscathed well, relatively unscathed usually. So that's what this this does, and so it's recognizing not that I'm bad, not that I'm stupid, not that I'm I'm a useless as a leader, but that I'm down in the maze and I need someone with a different perspective.
m:Pivotal times in our leadership. We brought in. We brought in at great expenses. We brought in Consulting, we brought but it was worth every penny. Yeah, it was so needed because that made everything so clear and everything and answered questions that we were struggling with and losing time on and it accelerated everything. It even changed, in some places, our life direction. Personally it when we had the personal Consulting that went on.
a:So strategic advising is a little different, it's a bigger picture, but it's amazing, even sometimes as a leader too, and you're have, if you're having trouble rallying your team, just having that voice, come in say things that it's reinforcing what you're saying, and when your team just hears it from a different voice Sometimes you that makes a world of difference.
m:Maybe you're struggling with well, self-serving if I bring up this issue and deal with it because it's the problem, well, that's when you have have that like us, come in and do that with your team behind the scenes Because it's it's not like you're self-serving something right, and that's how we were very familiar with that. Again, we have accessed that and done that with with other peers and in people that we have relationship that was able to help us along through a crisis or to divert a crisis in, because we saw it coming. So all of this is the Lord's will for your life to be able to overcome a crisis. Do not be propelled by it, do not be dispelled, do not be dispersed, do not run. The Lord is with you and he will take care of you, give you strength and bless you.
a:Amen. So you are not alone and, yes, you have God, but there are others too that can come alongside of you and walk this journey. So be encouraged today.
m:Pray about it. Let's talk you.